WHAT HAS TRANSPIRED

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

Enchanted Dragons

Just call me Enchanted!

Remember the Lost

(Christian | #Equal | Bisexual)

 

If you turn into a flower

you must be the most delicate ever

even if you bloom, just occasionally

you're the only perfect flower for me

 

simply Danganronpa

Mods y'all gonna let that post through???

Nekomaru is dead, currently observing the Strawberry House now

It's so weird to have someone speaking that isn't Hajime and not see their sprite tbh

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

"Isn't it obvious? I'm playing Russian Roulette"

Yeah Monomi, keep up :v

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

Hmmmmmmm

It was rly cool to get a look at what Nagito thinks!

Other than that not much to say yet

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

rn I just rly want to see Hajime deck Nagito across the lounge tbh

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

How much did the let's player struggle with the puzzles in the Final Dead Room?

 

There's a gif with Hajime slamming Nagito into a wall, from three different angles, it's so glorious. I found it pretty easily, just look for "hajime nagito gif"

 

Also, Nagito's "lol hope" and ridiculous luck strike again. I wonder what he saw through the window?

 

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

Enchanted Dragons

Just call me Enchanted!

Remember the Lost

(Christian | #Equal | Bisexual)

 

If you turn into a flower

you must be the most delicate ever

even if you bloom, just occasionally

you're the only perfect flower for me

 

simply Danganronpa

She figured out everything except for the Othello puzzle pretty easily

Apparently she had to look that one up xD

tbh it probably would have taken me forever to figure that out too--

 

That

That sounds like a good gif

 

Nagito's luck thing certainly is interesting...

The LP'er I'm watching brought it up back when he "rigged" the straw drawings, and I think it's an interesting way to look at it that he's undoubtedly realized. His luck doesn't just refer to skewed human values of good and bad, it simply looks at statistic probability and forces the outcome towards the least likely event, hence why he played the game with five bullets instead of just one; loading a single bullet would have undoubtedly killed him.

idk I just think it's a rly cool concept tbh- I wonder how much his luck can bend though? If there a limit to what he can do relying on his luck??

And I'm assuming so, but I wonder if Makoto would be able to use his luck like that if he was a bit sharper.

 

And that window... I get the feeling that it's something related to the Future Foundation again. I wonder what he could have possibly seen through that tiny window that would click everything together though- it must have been something pretty monumental...

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

well, again, can't say much except "you'll see" :P

 

the let's player I watched also had to search it up; probably more for the japanese audience who would've been more familiar with the game. 

 

Nagito's luck is explained in his free time events, so another thing you can look forward too! It isn't quite what your guy's theory is though. 

 

Compared to Makoto's luck, Nagito is definitely really exaggerated. Enough for it to be an actual talent I would think, it's rather ridiculous. I think Naegi's luck is way subtler.

 

Can't say too much about the window, but judging from that you must've seen the "Ultimate Weapon"? The room full of weapons I mean, and what Nagito read in the files. From his behaviour, which has changed, what did you think he read in those files? Keep in mind that Nagito himself might be lying about what he saw

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

Enchanted Dragons

Just call me Enchanted!

Remember the Lost

(Christian | #Equal | Bisexual)

 

If you turn into a flower

you must be the most delicate ever

even if you bloom, just occasionally

you're the only perfect flower for me

 

simply Danganronpa

Yeah, I actually left off having just been about to start the trial last night.

 

I just can't figure out what he could have possibly seen that would make him develop that kind of complex so quickly...

I'm just really curious to find out now

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

What happened? Is it the trial yet?

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

Enchanted Dragons

Just call me Enchanted!

Remember the Lost

(Christian | #Equal | Bisexual)

 

If you turn into a flower

you must be the most delicate ever

even if you bloom, just occasionally

you're the only perfect flower for me

 

simply Danganronpa

Still rly early in the trial, ended up being out all morning shopping

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

I can't believe this group of high schoolers doesn't know what an elevator is

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

"I didn't expect you to know that"

....

Nagito he's a high school student I think they know what octogons are

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

"I don't want to die either"

 

I've decided that this situation is that one text post meme where someone has an evil clone and tells their friend to shoot the real version but the friend aims at the clone because the real version would never pass up an opportunity to die

 

What I'm saying is that this Nagito is actually an evil clone and I meme too much for my own good don't take me seriously

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

OH

I think I figured out how Nekomaru was killed

He was put into sleep mode, then tied up with the wire to the fake Grape Hall door. The killer went to Grape House and entered the tower from there, causing the elevator to leave Nekomaru tied up at the door. His weight broke the door handle, taking the screws out with it, and he landed headfirst on the pillar, causing it to fall with him. He handed on his back on the elevator floor, which is what jarred his limbs and head out of their sockets.

 

What I still can't figure out is the time. His clock was apparently set to 7:30, but he was found at 7:00.... Was he killed at 7:30 pm instead? iirc Akane heard the rumbling sound at 5:30 am though...That is the same time to Strawberry House clock started ringing, was that what she heard??

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

WOW

Nagito needs to stop throwing so much shade at Hajime I swear--

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

Hmmmm

I must say, Gundham was a pretty good blackened. His overall demeanor didn't start cracking until he was outright told "hey you're the killer" and his plan was pretty solid. He only really went wrong because of a few chance problems.

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

I find that, in a lot of these cases, the blackened has a good plan, but they're caught because of something they couldn't control/something unexpected. In this particular trial: Fuyuhiko staying in the lounge. 

 

I admit I cried at the end of Gundam's execution when he went to "heaven", because -- as I've previously stated -- I like Gundam a lot. Maybe that's also why I was pretty forgiving of him. Did you think his motive was "noble" though? Nekomaru and Gundam agreed that, one of them would die so the others wouldn't need to. However, if this was the case, why did he fight against being called the blackened? Was it really because he wanted to be painted as "the villain who killed one of their classmates"? 

 

The let's player I was watching also happened to complete Gundam's FTEs just before the trial so I was even more biased XD

 

Also, yes. Nagito throwing shade. Do you know why? 

 

The thing Nagito saw through the window ended up being the secret of the funhouse only. No new Future Foundation stuff, yet, but they still haven't revealed what Nagito saw in that packet. 

 

Next, about the timing: it was because the killer set the time backwards, so 5:30 was actually 7:30 I believe. Right? (Memory might be a tad bit fuzzy)

 

Never got to mention it before, but: Chiaki stopping Hajime from entering the Final Dead Room was really nice of her. I don't think Hajime's lucky enough for the Russian Roulette, we can't have a protagonist dying on us

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

Enchanted Dragons

Just call me Enchanted!

Remember the Lost

(Christian | #Equal | Bisexual)

 

If you turn into a flower

you must be the most delicate ever

even if you bloom, just occasionally

you're the only perfect flower for me

 

simply Danganronpa

Hnnnnnnnnnnnng

His execution was not okay I cried too--

 

I'd say he did have a good motive, though I'm indifferent on calling it "noble." I did like listening to his reasoning; I find that the killers in general are more likeable because you really get to see their true colors when they reveal their motives. I feel like, inside, he probably was scared. He was quite convincingly able to accept his fate, but I feel like there's more going on than just what we saw of him.

 

The one I'm watching is trying to do the events as evenly as possible, so she hasn't done more than two for any one person yet. I think the only one she didn't get to talk to was Peko actually...

 

Honestly in general I'm still incredibly confused about him. It's clearly more than "Hajime is reserve course trash and I know more than anyone here." Something seems to have drastically changed his view of everything in that file; I don't actually think I heard him mention hope basically at all through the trial, not to mention the whole "I don't want to die either" thing.

 

Yeah, that was right.

 

Hnnng, I rly like Chiaki. Yeah, that was definitely good on her part xD

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

So, how did Nagito treat the other students, not just Hajime? 

 

Not sure if I mentioned it before, but I think I mentioned something along the lines of "the trials in DR2 are more emotional" compared to the 1st game. I can see what you're talking about with Gundam too. It's like in the first game where Naegi comments on how calm Celeste was, but thinks that her demeanor was just another lie. Gundam probably had to keep on holding to his "character", because he wanted his death to save the others and freaking out wouldn't reassure them to keep on living. 

 

I like Chiaki too, not just because she's a gamer; she's so nice and sweet, also dorky too and that really appeals to me

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

Enchanted Dragons

Just call me Enchanted!

Remember the Lost

(Christian | #Equal | Bisexual)

 

If you turn into a flower

you must be the most delicate ever

even if you bloom, just occasionally

you're the only perfect flower for me

 

simply Danganronpa

He's just

So condescending

I'm 99% sure I mentioned it but he really reminds me of Byakuya 1.0 with his overall tone and demeanor the last chapter

 

But HAH

Hajime has FRIENDS

Get rekt Nagito, Hajime has the power of FRIENDSHIP on his side

 

 

Yeah, I'm pretty sure you did mention that- I'm rly feeling it

 

Honestly everything about Chiaki is so good. I think the best part is that she's not really a fanservice character and is actually smart (also can I say I'm rly happy that the ultimate gamer is one of the smart ones of the group) and it's just?? Perfect.

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

Definitely, not just to Hajime either. He used to be so praising of everyone, even Hajime, since they were "the symbols of hope" that he admired so much. It really is like a complete shift from his normal, self-depreciating self

 

The power of FRIENDSHIP prevails again! Despair Bear can't touch this, nor can Hope Fanatic

 

Chiaki seems even self aware with how she tried to troll Hajime/the player in Ch.3's investigation. I like her a bit better than Kyoko, maybe I like how warm she is + her contributions to the trials. As Hajime's partner, I'm really glad they let someone so nice live up this far since Danganronpa's trend is usually to kill off the developed characters lol

 

The emotional factor is one of the reasons I consider this game to be better than the last. I progressively like each game + cast better in this series lol (The designs and improved graphics along with updated game mechanics contribute a lot to it I think)

 

Also, what do you think of the music? I find the investigation theme super groovy and I adore the Rebuttal Showdown theme too (let's not forget the execution soundtrack with REACH FOR THE STARS, REACH SO HIGHHHH) 

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

Enchanted Dragons

Just call me Enchanted!

Remember the Lost

(Christian | #Equal | Bisexual)

 

If you turn into a flower

you must be the most delicate ever

even if you bloom, just occasionally

you're the only perfect flower for me

 

simply Danganronpa

yeah, I think I found myself warming up to Chiaki a lot faster than I did with Kyoko too. Though I suppose that makes sense based on who they are.

 

I definitely see why you say that, it's certainly gotten a lot more emotions out of me in this one. I'm scared of v3 I don't want to die of emotions--

I will say, I've seen a lot of the v3 cast before even being interested in dr and they uh.

They're certainly something.

 

The music... I've mentioned it before, but I don't rly pay much attention to the music. Generally I'm more focused on the dialogue (and the player I'm watching is reading all the dialogue aloud so generally talking over the music) so I don't have much of an opinion? When I do get a chance to hear it I love it though!! I think Monokuma's theme and the closing argument theme are the two I notice the most.

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

FINALLY TIME FOR CHIAKI'S FTES I SWEAR

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

She's so happy about petting a cow??

What a pure girl

Gosh I love her

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

"Why hello there Hajime"

SLAM THE DOOR IN HIS FACE HAJIME--

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

*Flicks Nagito on the forehead*

No

Do not blow up the hotel stop

 

 

Also can I comment on his voice because??

It's so good.

His voice- and especially laugh- are so unsettling.

He sounds out of breath all the time but when I say it like that it just looses all its edge

He sounds... sick.

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

BLOWING UP THE ENTIRE ISLAND IS EVEN WORSE

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

"You don't have a driver's license!"

Yeah but I don't think Nagito does either and did that apparently stop him?

 

 

 

What I'm wondering is where he even got those bombs...

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

Nagito, you're uh
Not lookin' too good there buddy
That's uh
An awful lot of pink...

 

 

 

That's a bit overkill holy cow--

I think the let's player's reaction sums it up perfectly: "Um"

Certainly wasn't expecting that.

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

.....

Only slightly related but I had a terrifying thought

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

What's your thought?

 

considering it's Nagito, it's sure to be an interesting case. Perhaps even the best 

 

let's see what happens

 

also, on another note, the atmosphere in which you find Nagito's body is great. The creepy music, and the fact that it's a piece of evidence too, and the slightly glitchy version of the body discovery music all contribute to the aura of "something's off"

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

Enchanted Dragons

Just call me Enchanted!

Remember the Lost

(Christian | #Equal | Bisexual)

 

If you turn into a flower

you must be the most delicate ever

even if you bloom, just occasionally

you're the only perfect flower for me

 

simply Danganronpa

tbh I was mainly speaking to myself about that but

In my mind I was just sarcastically saying "gee I wonder what a spear through the stomach means" and my brain helpfully responded "Unless he's a ghoul that normally means he's dead."

And now I can't get the thought of ghoul Nagito out of my head because honestly that is a cursed idea

 

 

Honestly, there's something... too off about this, even before doing more than a preliminary observation (As in I haven't gotten to the actual investigation quite yet). Everything about his state is strange; it clearly took a lot of planning to set up. And that's where it gets weird. Setting up such an extensive killing would take a lot of forethought and consideration, but how did the killer know he was going to be in the warehouse in the first place? I found it plausible at first that the killer had taken him up on his previous offer to plan his murder together, but his expression in death is clearly fearful. Even his mouth was taped up, which is something I'll touch on later. But he's the character you'd least expect to fear his death, unless whatever he discovered change that too. If he were consulted with, he undoubtedly wouldn't be scared. But if he wasn't, who had the knowledge to know where he'd be and the time to set up?

 

Back to the mouth taping thing: how? Everyone was grouped up for what I assume is close to an hour. No one had time to go kill him. Honestly, that small detail alone makes me think that it may have been suicide, there's no way anyone else could have taped him up or done anything else there, unless he'd been tied up for quite a while...

 

But then comes the question: Why? In fact, why is such a clearly torturous death needed from anyone? There's just that much more evidence left around because of how much was done to him. If it was suicide, why would he find the need to kill himself? And there's his expression again too... I suppose it's plausible he's trying to mess with the investigation from beyond the grave.

There are just a lot of questions that need answering here, and every one I think of just contradicts the last.

 

 

Anyways, I honestly didn't expect him to end up dying. I fully expected him to make it out of there tbh.

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

Well, with DR2 and DRV3, they need to subvert the expectations given by the first games. That's why it's important to watch everything in order :P

 

you got to suicide remarkably quickly. Won't say much else about it :)

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

Enchanted Dragons

Just call me Enchanted!

Remember the Lost

(Christian | #Equal | Bisexual)

 

If you turn into a flower

you must be the most delicate ever

even if you bloom, just occasionally

you're the only perfect flower for me

 

simply Danganronpa

Thinking about it logically, suicide seems to be the one with the least contradictions. But even then... He seemed pretty securely tied up, how would he have made those stab wounds or tripped something that would bring the spear down? The wounds have to have been made during.... what, four or five hours that were spent by the others investigating. There's just so much that doesn't make sense yet, though I suppose it will soon...

 

 

Also Kazuichi be nice to my daughter she needs to investigate :v

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

Hmmmm

Overall an uninformative investigation as it pertains to the murder, it seems. Though I'm sure it'll all be sorted out, I'm curious to see how this goes down. There really weren't many clues about the case to be found.

 

 

Also gosh it's so weird to see Nagito's card red. I honestly expected him to get through everything alive, this case certainly was jarring.

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

true

 

still not much to say XD except that I also expected Nagito to live to the end. Byakuya was the "rival" character of DR1, and he lived, but the "rival" in DR2 didn't end up living...

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

Enchanted Dragons

Just call me Enchanted!

Remember the Lost

(Christian | #Equal | Bisexual)

 

If you turn into a flower

you must be the most delicate ever

even if you bloom, just occasionally

you're the only perfect flower for me

 

simply Danganronpa

hhhhh normally this stuff doesn't bother me but also I just cringed rly hard at the idea of stabbing your own palm that deep onto a knife

Afshavajdvdjab palms are so sensitive--

 

Anyways now I'm understanding all the setup + the state of his body but the "torture" thing still has me confused

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

hhhh

Okay I know this is out of the blue and not something I should really be thinking about while looking at Nagito's dead body but also his hoodie/jacket thing is really cool and I want it

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

Okay stepping away from DR for just a second

"You're expecting me to work with ghouls!?"

"Yes!"

 

Hide is

So blessed

You work with those ghouls buddy

  • Posted at:

Please tell us why you'd like to report this post

~{}Lily{}~

 

Trash Squad ~ Aro/Ace ~ Regretting Life Choices ~ Drawing or Reading Probably

 

 

 

"Oh how disgusting, all this disguising, to become somebody that's worth existing."

    1 , 2 , 3 ... , , 7 , ... 15 , 16 , 17